Hope Starts With Us: The Healing Power of Art

Art can help us process past experiences, explore our emotions, and expand our perspectives. In this episode, NAMI CEO Dan Gillison is joined by NAMI Ambassadors and artists Alex Alpert and Pepper Auerbach, as well as The Franklin Institute’s Jayatri Das. Together, they discuss how art impacts mental health, as well as the connection between physical and mental health. Alex and Pepper will have artwork presented in The Franklin Institute’s upcoming exhibition, “Body Odyssey,” in part about how science can help all of us find balance in our mental and physical health.

You can find additional episodes of this NAMI podcast and others at nami.org/podcast.

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Featured Guests:

Alex Alpert

Social:
Twitter/X: @AlexAlpert6
Instagram: @Alex.Alpert

Alex Alpert is an artist, creator, mental health advocate, and ambassador for NAMI. Based out of New York City, Alex also works as a Creative Director with several brands. Working as a street artist while studying music in school, Alex went on to build a career at Universal Music Group. Here, he excelled in brand partnerships, marketing, and artist relations.

While at UMG, Alex also expanded his practice as a visual artist. He began by making pieces for the musicians he was working with and creating live art during concerts and events. After a few years, he was painting murals around the country, drawing live at huge events, and collaborating with major brands and celebrities. Alex also created a live art piece at NAMICon 2024 and is participating in The Franklin Institute’s upcoming exhibition featuring pieces about mental health.

Pepper Auerbach

Social:
Instagram: @iwasateenagepepper

Pepper Auerbach is a New York based writer and illustrator with a wide variety of artistic styles. Pepper works in the horror genre as well as in children’s literature and seeks to teach important lessons of self-love to people around the world.

They have taught art classes to elementary school-age children both during the school year and in the summer, mostly focused on comic-creation and character design. Pepper is a graduate of the School of Visual Arts but wants to continue their education into grad school to become an art therapist for kids with disabilities.

Pepper is inspired by artists and writers like Charles Forsman, Clive, and Eduardo Valdés-Hevia. Many styles are incorporated from this inspiration including traditional and digital cartooning, storytelling, and edited photography. The visuals and the stories that go with them are heavily influenced by life experiences and dreams that Pepper has had, as they are in a near-constant flow for them.

Jayatri Das

Social:
Instagram: @FranklinInstitute
Twitter/X: @TheFranklin

Dr. Jayatri Das is Director of Science Content and Chief Bioscientist at The Franklin Institute and an invited Fellow of the Center for Neuroscience & Society at the University of Pennsylvania. She has developed science content for multiple exhibitions at TFI, including Body Odyssey (opening November 2024) and Your Brain, a national award-winning exhibit about the neuroscience and psychology of the human brain. She also directs local and national programming initiatives to advance informal science education about vaccines, materials science, neuroethics and other areas of emerging science and their societal impact.

Das earned her Ph.D. in evolutionary biology from Princeton University. Her work and community impact have been honored with the American Alliance of Museums’ Nancy Hanks Award for Professional Excellence, the Philadelphia Business Journal’s Women of Distinction Award, and the Blooloop 50 Museum Influencer List. She is an honorary fellow of the American Association for the Advancement of Science.

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About the Host:

Daniel H. Gillison, Jr.

Social: @DanGillison

Dan Gillison brings expertise in non-profit leadership and a passion for advocating for people with mental illness to NAMI. Before coming to NAMI, Dan led the American Psychiatric Association Foundation (APAF), where he was responsible for strategic planning, personnel management, board communications, oversight of APAF’s public education programs and outreach, and formulating strategic alliances and partnerships to further APAF’s mission. Prior to APAF, Gillison led County Solutions and Innovation for the National Association of Counties, where he was instrumental in repositioning the organization’s programs to provide expertise in health and human services, justice, and public safety.

Dan has more than 30 years of experience and has previously held leadership positions at Xerox, Nextel, and Sprint. Dan holds a B.A. from Southern University and A&M College. Dan spearheaded the creation of the CEO Alliance for Mental Health in 2020, which represents some of the most vulnerable and diverse populations affected by disparities in the mental health care system. The leadership collective has collaborated to identify and amplify their priorities for creating a future of quality mental health care for all who need it. Dan serves on lululemon’s Mental Wellbeing Global Advisory Board.

Transcript

00:00:00:00 – 00:00:23:19
Jayatri
So when you think about the fact that what art does to the brain is unlock some of the connections between the different networks that are active. But there are kind of three networks that are at play and kind of take different precedents at different points in time. But those three are generally categorized as the imagination network, the attention network and your goal oriented network.

00:00:23:21 – 00:00:44:11
Jayatri
And art helps us break down some of the barriers between how those three networks sometimes function. And I could explain that, but it’s much clearer and much more intuitive to appreciate that when you just look at the art, you know what happens when you unlock that imagination, when you let go of some of that, you know, goal-oriented self control.

00:00:44:13 – 00:00:52:01
Jayatri
These magical moments appear that let us connect the kind of deeper thoughts that then affect our both mental and physical health.

00:00:52:03 – 00:01:15:02
Dan
Welcome to Hope Starts With Us, a podcast by NAMI, the National Alliance on Mental Illness. My name is Daniel H. Gillison Jr. I’m the CEO for NAMI and your host for this podcast. I want to start out by mentioning the title of this podcast, and it’s the Healing Power of Art. And as we talk about the healing power of art, let me give you a little bit of the description of the episode.

00:01:15:04 – 00:01:42:08
Dan
Art can help us process past experiences, explore our emotions, and expand our perspectives. In this episode, I am joined by NAMI ambassadors and artists Alex Alpert and Pepper Auerbach as well as the Franklin Institute’s Jayatri Das. Welcome to all three of you. Together, they discuss how art impacts mental health, as well as the connect between physical and mental health.

00:01:42:10 – 00:02:04:06
Dan
Alex and Pepper will have artwork presented in the Franklin Institute’s upcoming exhibition, Body Odyssey, in part about how science can help all of us find balance in our mental and physical health. We’re so happy to have all three of them with us. And as we start this and we’ll get into introductions about them and who they are and what they do in a second.

00:02:04:11 – 00:02:30:11
Dan
But let me start out about why this podcast and we started this podcast because we believe that hope starts with us. And there’s five elements of this. Hope starts with us talking about mental health. Hope starts with us making information accessible. Hope starts with us providing resources and practical advice. Hope starts with us sharing our stories, and hope starts with us breaking the stigma.

00:02:30:13 – 00:03:02:00
Dan
If you or a loved one is struggling with a mental health condition and have been looking for hope, we made this podcast for you. Hope starts with all of us. Hope is a collective. We hope that each episode, with each conversation brings you into that collective so you know you’re not alone. So a little bit more about exploring the healing impact of art therapy can provide a way to express emotions and experiences not easily expressed in words.

00:03:02:02 – 00:03:30:01
Dan
Art can be healing through the process of making art. The journey of creating and feeling is more important than the destination: the final finished piece. Art therapy can reduce distress, help build self-esteem and support development of social skills and emotional resilience. NAMI did a research study, along with the Adobe Foundation, that showed that there is a powerful connection between creativity and mental health.

00:03:30:03 – 00:04:04:19
Dan
Some of the findings included 63% that said, creativity can improve confidence in abilities. 61% said creativity can reduce feelings of stress or anxiety, and 57% say creativity can improve mental well-being. Now, our guests: Alex Alpert, pronouns: he/him, Pepper Auerbach, pronouns: they/them, Jayatri Das: she/her. To all three of you, welcome. So Alex Alpert and Pepper Auerbach are NAMI ambassadors and artists by education and career.

00:04:04:21 – 00:04:26:13
Dan
Alex created a live art piece at the NAMICon convention and has worked with a number of brands including Adobe, Nike and the Grammys. Pepper is a graduate of the School of Visual Arts. Pepper created art last year for our partners at Publicis. Alex and Pepper were both at NAMICon 2024 and they collaborated on our remembrance tree.

00:04:26:15 – 00:04:54:14
Dan
Thank you for doing that. Jayatri Das is from the Franklin Institute. She is a chief bio scientist and the director of science content at the Franklin Institute. She’s joining us because she is coordinating with NAMI staff to source art pieces for an upcoming exhibition, Body Odyssey, highlighting health and the human body. You know, as the World Health Organization has said and Dr. David Satcher had coined years ago, there is no physical health without mental health.

00:04:54:18 – 00:05:24:18
Dan
So that’s what this is about. We hope the exhibit will help visitors appreciate how human biology balances different systems and functions, how new technologies shape new ways we think, and how science can help all of us make smart decisions about our mental and physical health. Part of the exhibit explores a range of perspectives on art therapy and celebrates careers in mental health, and it will offer the opportunity to show how art therapy can offer new and healthy ways of pursuing inner balance.

00:05:24:19 – 00:05:46:07
Dan
And we all need that. The exhibit name is Body Odyssey. The exhibit dates: it opens on the 23rd of November, and we’ll ask more about how long the exhibit will be there in just a minute. So I just wanted to start out by thanking Jayatri for her leadership, her vision, and her bringing our exhibit to the Franklin Institute. To Alex and Pepper,

00:05:46:12 – 00:06:01:19
Dan
you didn’t have to get on the plane and come out to Denver to be with us. Thank you for doing that. And thank you for being such great ambassadors and advocates for NAMI. It takes all of us and we appreciate it. So much. Thank you for your work. So with that said, I’m going to start out with this first question.

00:06:01:19 – 00:06:18:22
Dan
And that was a long setup, but I wanted to make sure you knew how much we appreciate all three of you and what you do. So can each of you tell us a little bit about how you think art can help find balance between mental and physical health? Let’s start out with the bio scientist. Jayatri?

00:06:19:02 – 00:06:48:18
Jayatri
I was hoping you’d ask. You know, I think, Dan, you really–you really set it up. There is no mental and physical health without each other. And I think the more that we’ve been learning about the science of how our bodies work and how our brains work, the more we’re understanding the physiological connections that unite those two. Like we know that, you know, even when you exercise, your brain is releasing hormones that make you feel better, which then make you want to exercise more.

00:06:48:18 – 00:07:06:18
Jayatri
And so it’s a great feedback loop to feel healthy about it. And the same is true. You know, when you’re not feeling healthy about it, that physical and mental illness are also connected. And I think being able to talk about the mental aspects of it gives us new insights into the physiology of it.

00:07:06:20 – 00:07:17:12
Dan
Jayatri, thank you so much. So let’s go to Alex. Can you tell us a little bit about how you think art can help find balance between mental and physical health? And not only can, but does.

00:07:17:14 – 00:07:46:01
Alex
Yeah. Thanks so much for having me here. And I’ve been drawing my whole life and, you know, only relatively recently made it my profession. Before that drawing was really many things to me. It was, you know, obviously a form of expressing how I feel like the world is and it’s a coping mechanism. It’s helped me through issues with anxiety, depression, a form of communication, you know, with people in my life or people I don’t even know personally.

00:07:46:03 – 00:08:17:03
Alex
And it’s a way for me to try to help people as well. You know, by trying to sleep, to claim things that I think are important since it’s become my profession, a lot of other kind of factors get thrown in when it comes to your job. But I really wanted to focus on my work with NAMI educational organizations that I’m a part of to try to impart that on young people, people of all ages. Really try to, you know, show them that drawing for me.

00:08:17:03 – 00:08:27:06
Alex
But really, any kind of visual arts, even music, any way of expressing yourself can just be a really valuable tool, if you know, making your way to life.

00:08:27:08 – 00:08:42:19
Dan
Yeah. Thank you, Alex, and I’m going to come back to you in just a minute, because I loved what I’ve seen about your free flowing work. So I want to come back and ask a question about that. But Pepper is a graduate of the School of Visual Arts. You’re putting words on paper, but you also put art on paper, and words are art.

00:08:42:21 – 00:08:50:01
Dan
And I just wanted to ask you this question. How do you think art can help and does help find balance between mental and physical health?

00:08:50:03 – 00:09:19:21
Pepper
Well, for me, art has always been very therapeutic. I’m sure it has been for many people. You know, it’s therapy and it’s been very meditative for me. It’s been very helpful to clear my head and help me understand that things are more simple than we think they are. That it’s always been very helpful to me to be able to draw my feelings out, to write out autobiographical stories like the one I’m working on now.

00:09:19:23 – 00:09:25:21
Pepper
It’s been a meditative experience to be able to express what I’m thinking, in that way.

00:09:25:23 – 00:09:47:03
Dan
Thank you. Pepper. Alex. you know, you’ve been called a stream of consciousness illustrator and known for the free flowing lines and the detailed shading. I got to see some of that. I’m seeing the words, but I’m visualizing what I got to see at NAMICon, and it’s almost like you grab the instrument, if you will, and you start.

00:09:47:03 – 00:10:06:10
Dan
And I’m like, this. Does Alex have this in his head already? When you create Alex, what do you follow? What? What’s the feeling, the thought, the theme? And do you receive some type of a, catharsis or relief through this creation? And all of us that are standing back watching, I’m like, how does he do what, what, what?

00:10:06:11 – 00:10:08:17
Dan
And then all of a sudden, the visual is there.

00:10:08:18 – 00:10:33:16
Alex
Yeah. Well, I think, Pepper said something really important, which is kind of like the meditative aspect of it, expecially that, yeah, stream of consciousness way of illustrating for me. I didn’t always draw that way. You know, I used to do realism and portraits and landscapes and that kind of drawing and creation wasn’t for me, very cathartic. I was very much a perfectionist and needed to look a certain way.

00:10:33:18 – 00:10:58:02
Alex
I was never really satisfied. It wasn’t until 4 or 5 years ago I kind of decided to embrace this kind of more free flowing creation, where I’m not really planning it, just starting with lines, shapes. Eventually they kind of form imagery that you and I might identify as something, a face, building whatever. And then I just kind of branch off of that, that I

00:10:58:04 – 00:11:23:23
Alex
felt all of a sudden like, that kind of meditative, cathartic feeling where it didn’t necessarily matter, you know, what it was that I’m drawing or how it looks. It’s about the act of expression. You come up with techniques to kind of like, make it look aesthetic, at least to you. But, you know, once, once I embraced that, I was like, I can’t really make a mistake and whatever happens, happens.

00:11:23:23 – 00:11:53:10
Alex
And, you know, if something looks a certain way, it’s not vibing with your vision, you can kind of shift it and like kind of change the direction of it. And that is what it became very meditative. And I was able to kind of identify that, because when I do it, still, even when it’s like a job, time goes by crazy fast, which is always kind of how I’m like, okay, this is like something I’m enjoying. It becomes a problem when you have a deadline for PR or something and you’re like, it’s been ten hours and I still have this much more to go.

00:11:53:16 – 00:12:32:12
Alex
But yeah, that that kind of drawing even if it’s not your specialty, and I know plenty of tremendously talented artists who do realist portraits and, you know, landscapes and things like that. I often encourage them, anybody to like, sometimes just try this kind of like freestyle drawing where you’re not really thinking about anything in particular, but you’re inspired maybe by something in your subconscious or people around you or music that you’re listening to and I think that’s a really kind of valuable way of expressing yourself in maybe more of a raw way.

00:12:32:14 – 00:12:51:11
Dan
You know, Alex, you mentioned a couple things. You said up until 4 or 5 years ago you were a perfectionist, and then you let go of that. And you know that in this new work that you do, you can’t make a mistake. So what was that, that evolution for you? Because there’s others, you know, peers, they’re living their lives where they feel in their life,

00:12:51:11 – 00:13:05:07
Dan
they have to be a perfectionist. And we know that there is no such thing as perfection. What was that turning point for you to say? I can let go of perfection for this, and I know I can’t make a mistake now.

00:13:05:09 – 00:13:31:11
Alex
Yeah, it’s a freeing thing. I also don’t want to pretend that I’m never not self-critical or, you know, think something looks exactly the way I want it to. But on the whole, I think the turning point was like I was working another job full time at the time and was just kind of drawing for fun. And I think I was like, still living in Los Angeles and was on the beach was just kind of drawing, the landscape around me.

00:13:31:11 – 00:13:50:16
Alex
And I was thinking like, it doesn’t need to look exactly like I’m seeing it. And it was very much just for me. And I liked how it looked and it also turned into this very abstract, weird, like, not at all what I was seeing and it almost kind of like, moved itself in what I was looking at.

00:13:50:16 – 00:14:07:06
Alex
It was just kind of stuff that was going on in my head, and I liked it. And that was really the thing that clicked was I liked it, and the more I did it, I did get better at it and more kind of techniques to it. You know, even if it is freestyle and there’s no mistakes, there is kind of like kind of methods I use.

00:14:07:08 – 00:14:32:00
Alex
But I always feel good about it. And the funny thing happened, but I think other artists, and performers, whatever can identify with this, probably anybody. Like once you feel kind of good about it or confident about it, people also kind of respond to it positively, like because I think they can sense when it is a subjective thing like art, people kind of play off your energy in the kind of sense that you feel confident about it

00:14:32:00 – 00:14:52:16
Alex
and good about it. So they’re like, oh, I like this too. And that’s kind of like, I embrace that. So I really kind of leaned into this thing where, you know, again, I don’t always feel like it’s perfect or great about it, but I feel confident about what I created and it was what I wanted to make at this time.

00:14:52:16 – 00:15:13:06
Alex
And that’s, I think what allowed me to, like, also make it a career. Make it a profession because if I was being a perfectionist about everything, I don’t think I could, you know, keep my sanity, doing it professionally every day. So yeah, that’s that’s kind of the moment, more or less. But still, it’s very much a journey still.

00:15:13:06 – 00:15:15:09
Alex
And, you know, ups and downs.

00:15:15:11 – 00:15:31:20
Dan
Well your work is engaging and you are still a bit of a perfectionist, I get it just in a different venue, if you will. I see it, the lines and the work is so clean. It’s engaging, it brings you in. It’s almost, as I watch, it’s almost like mind mapping. It’s just really cool to see how you envision it.

00:15:31:20 – 00:15:54:17
Dan
And then for the layperson like myself, to stand back and watch it be created, you know, kudos to you for that and for sharing that. So, Pepper, your art style includes traditional and digital cartooning, storytelling, and edited photography. You also incorporate some horror genre as well as children’s literature to teach them important lessons about self-love.

00:15:54:17 – 00:16:07:05
Dan
So you do a lot to make such a big difference in different communities. What does art truly mean to you, and how has creating your art shaped, your views about mental health?

00:16:07:07 – 00:16:27:08
Pepper
Thank you, I’ve always made art, even when I was a kid. You know, I’ve always been drawing monsters and creepy things, but, like, I think a lot of that has been to express–I have schizoaffective disorder and I express a lot of my, my hallucinations and things like that through, my art. And I think it’s been very therapeutic for me.

00:16:27:08 – 00:16:57:01
Pepper
I think I want to be more kind to myself about that. Art means to me that I can share my experiences with other people, and I’ve always wanted to help people in that way. I’ve always wanted to help people understand that it’s not as simple as “mental illness is bad.” I think it’s much more complicated than that. And I think that with my experiences, I have learned to accept a lot of what I deal with and also get help for things that I have a hard time with.

00:16:57:03 – 00:17:19:16
Dan
You can see this over my back. These are some of our values. So from awareness to advocacy to compassion. One of those is inclusion. And Pepper, you’re very inclusive in terms of the work that you do, from children’s literature to digital cartooning to storytelling and edited photography. So this hits so many. It seems to be very inclusive.

00:17:19:18 – 00:17:24:18
Dan
Was that by chance, or was that something that you saw that you wanted to do?

00:17:24:20 – 00:17:59:08
Pepper
Well, I think representation is very important, and I think it’s vital. I’m non-binary and, you know, I’m a queer person and I feel like in order for us to really gain like a sense of acceptance with ourselves, then I think we need to see people like ourselves in media. With my stories, I do a lot of, inclusion because, I mean, even with horror, it’s still important to see yourself like in a character, like as long as the characters like, if the character is well written, like, that’s great.

00:17:59:10 – 00:18:06:09
Pepper
But we also need to have, like characters that are reflective of who we are in every aspect of ourselves.

00:18:06:10 – 00:18:26:09
Dan
Thank you. Thank you. Jayatri, I want to come to you for a minute and ask a question that I know our audience will love to know. First of all, thank you for your leadership and for bringing this exhibit, Body Odyssey. What made you decide on this exhibit? And then the next question is, can you tell the audience a little bit about a bio scientist?

00:18:26:11 – 00:18:55:07
Jayatri
Sure. So this exhibit came to be because health has always been one of the Franklin Institute’s core platforms when we talk about science and society. So some of your audience may or may not know that the Franklin Institute has had an iconic two story walk through Giant Heart as one of our exhibits since 1954. But we recognize that the conversation and how we talk about health is always changing.

00:18:55:09 – 00:19:17:22
Jayatri
And so this new exhibition keeps a Giant Heart as a centerpiece of the exhibit, but really aims to reflect, you know, the importance of different issues in health that we’re dealing with today in 2024. And we started the process of developing the exhibit by talking to kids. We talked to kids from, you know, middle school, high school.

00:19:18:00 – 00:19:48:00
Jayatri
And with every group that we talked to, their number one area of interest was mental health. And I think that really says a lot, both in terms of where our conversations of mental health are evolving. But also, you know, what’s on kids minds these days. And so we really wanted to make sure that this was a topic that we addressed honestly and productively while giving people that connection and point to bring in their own experiences.

00:19:48:02 – 00:20:08:17
Dan
Thank you. And I will say that I’ve been to the Franklin Institute as a dad of a middle school student. I was one of those parents that was on the bus from my daughter’s middle school all the way up to Philadelphia to the. Franklin Institue to actually walk through that heart and, to actually spend, a real good amount of time there back in,

00:20:08:18 – 00:20:21:22
Dan
I won’t date myself, but it was in the, in the early 90s, so, I know it. So thank you for that. If you don’t mind, because our audience always has an opportunity to learn about different fields, so a bio scientist.

00:20:22:00 – 00:20:53:13
Jayatri
So my role, yeah. So my role as a museum’s bio scientist is to talk about a wide spectrum of topics that affect how we as human beings, interact with the world around us every day. So centering those conversations on the interactions between our biology and the environment around us and thinking about how our bodies, our brains, how new technologies, the social environment and physical environment that we live in, all interplay.

00:20:53:15 – 00:21:16:05
Dan
That’s fantastic. We have a resource, here at NAMI called Hearts and Minds, and it’s really looking at that connective tissue between the organs and the mind. So and it’s called Hearts and Minds, and it’s really looking at that correlation between the physical and the mental and everything that’s connected from the standpoint of navigating. So yeah, appreciate that.

00:21:16:09 – 00:21:41:22
Jayatri
And I think one of the beautiful things about working at a museum is art plays into a lot of what we do in how we explain science and help people make connections to science. And as I was listening to Alex and Pepper just talk about your different processes, and the approaches that you take, and especially when I first saw your work, that share many common themes, but also look very different.

00:21:42:00 – 00:22:03:04
Jayatri
One of the things that I love about being able to include your work in the exhibit is that just seeing your art helps people understand the explanation of some of the science that we’re trying to convey. So when you think about the fact that you know, what art does to the brain is unlock some of the connections between the different networks that are active.

00:22:03:04 – 00:22:41:09
Jayatri
Right? So you have an imagination network, you have this attention network, you have this goal-oriented network. And art helps us break down some of the barriers between how those three networks sometimes function. And I could explain that, but it’s much clearer, much more intuitive to appreciate that when you just look at the art that Alex and Pepper are creating to see, you know, what happens when you unlock that imagination, when you let go of some of that, you know, goal-oriented self-control that, you know, these magical moments appear that let us connect the kind of deeper thoughts that then affect our both mental and physical health.

00:22:41:11 – 00:22:46:17
Dan
So yeah, would you repeat those networks? I think that was really cool.

00:22:46:20 – 00:23:06:20
Jayatri
Yeah, yeah. So our brain is always changing, always active. But there are kind of three networks that are at play and kind of take different precedents at different points in time. But those three are generally categorized as the imagination network. The attention network and your goal-oriented network.

00:23:06:22 – 00:23:28:00
Dan
That is fantastic. And when you talk about imagination, attention, and goal, these NAMI ambassadors here have the imagination, they have the attention and they’re very goal oriented and they’re so supportive of NAMI. We can’t thank them enough. And as we get ready to wrap up, the other thing I want to say is that we know this is about leadership, and Jayatri,

00:23:28:01 – 00:23:45:01
Dan
I want to thank you for your leadership there and, and your advocacy for this exhibit and on behalf of NAMI at the Franklin Institute, because I know you get, a lot of different opportunities for exhibits and for you to choose this. We were very appreciative of that. So I can’t wait to come up and to see it myself.

00:23:45:03 – 00:24:08:02
Jayatri
Well, I want to express my gratitude to NAMI as well, because, you know, our goal is to present, you know, science and stories in authentic as a way as possible and being able to connect with people like Pepper and Alex and everybody else at NAMI, who has played a role in our exhibit development process, it really makes the exhibit, as strong and as as connected to the community as you want it to be.

00:24:08:08 – 00:24:30:18
Dan
That’s outstanding. So, thank you for that. And before we conclude, I’d like to ask a question which we ask every guest for every podcast. The world can be a difficult place, and sometimes it can be hard to hold on to hope. That’s why with each episode, we dedicate the last couple of minutes of our podcast to a special segment called Hold On To Hope.

00:24:30:20 – 00:24:36:04
Dan
And so I want to ask each of you, what helps you hold on to hope?

00:24:36:06 – 00:25:02:05
Alex
For me, probably the people around me, my partner. my close friends, I’m lucky to have a pretty strong support system in my life and the people who recognize me for who I am and how I do express myself, you know, validate my goals, my feelings, and also are, you know, patient with ups and downs that I think everybody experiences.

00:25:02:07 – 00:25:08:17
Alex
So that is a consistent source of hope for me is just the amount of people I have around me in my life.

00:25:08:19 – 00:25:10:16
Dan
Thank you, Alex. Pepper?

00:25:10:18 – 00:25:12:00
Pepper
I get lonely sometimes.

00:25:12:05 – 00:25:13:08
Pepper
Like I feel alone.

00:25:13:08 – 00:25:37:22
Pepper
Because I have schizoaffective disorder, as I mentioned, and I don’t know that many people who also have this, who have been through psychotic episodes or anything like that. And so really it’s about for me building community. And I’ve done that a lot on, social media and stuff like that. I also think that, you know, the main two thoughts that I try to think when I’m low on hope are that I try to remember good days that I’ve had.

00:25:37:22 – 00:25:58:21
Pepper
And I try to remember that those kinds of days will happen again, maybe even like try to recreate a day like that. Spend a day with a friend that you spent with on that day, try to connect to people. And I think my other thought is when I’m not as energized artistically, I consider those periods a waiting period.

00:25:58:23 – 00:26:20:11
Pepper
It’s very much just time for me to relax, not overwork myself. Try not to focus on art as much, because, you know, sometimes you just don’t have the energy for it. And I think that’s really valuable time you can spend with, like, family, with friends, whoever you really trust, really. And you could go to the park, do whatever you want.

00:26:20:12 – 00:26:30:00
Pepper
Listen to music. I mean, like, I’ve been listening to a lot of music lately and on walks and stuff, and it’s just so relaxing. With art it’s really important to give yourself time.

00:26:30:02 – 00:26:40:11
Dan
Thank you, and you give yourself grace to be yourself and to understand, what works best for you, when. Thank you, for sharing. Pepper. Jayatri, I want to come to you.

00:26:40:13 – 00:27:14:01
Jayatri
I think for me, I, I always try to listen, to learn. And that brings me a lot of hope. I am lucky to be in a place that values so many different people’s perspectives. And I’m a storyteller, and I want to hear other people’s stories and represent those stories in the work that we do. And people are endlessly interesting and hearing about, you know, the good work that people are doing and the creative things that people are doing, like, we’re not in this alone.

00:27:14:03 – 00:27:15:22
Jayatri
And that really brings me a lot of hope.

00:27:16:00 – 00:27:34:20
Dan
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Every now and then the tables get turned and people ask me what. Dan, what helps you hold on to hope? I love the industry of people. And I remember in college someone once told me, she said, then there will be times where you’ll be lonely. You’ll never be alone. Those lonely times are really interesting because I love the industry of people.

00:27:34:20 – 00:28:07:00
Dan
I love connecting with people. I love learning from people. And there are those moments where it feels, like during COVID, that there’s these walls around you can’t navigate. So, it’s something that you have to be in touch with. And what helps me hold on to hope is knowing that, there are people that you can interact with that really are about the whole, and, and really trying to look at whole health from the standpoint of how are you really doing and making sure that, you know, we say you’re not alone, that that’s real.

00:28:07:00 – 00:28:35:16
Dan
So that’s something that is important to me. And the other thing that has me hold on to hope is young people, because myself and others that are in this space, we will be over here to the side and we will need young leaders to be in this work. And I’m very inspired. And what gives me hope is that young people that are lending their voice and speaking about mental health and lending their art to this work, so that gives me a lot of hope, because there was a time when that was not something that was happening.

00:28:35:16 – 00:28:57:18
Dan
And also for leaders of like teaching at the Franklin Institute to say, hey, it’s both and it’s not either or. I’m telling you straight up that that absolutely gives me hope. So with that said, I want to come back to Jayatri to talk about the exhibit Body Odyssey. It’s opening on the 23rd of November. Would you like to share something with the audience about the exhibit and would love for you to do that before we wrap up.

00:28:57:18 – 00:28:58:15
Dan

00:28:58:19 – 00:29:20:18
Jayatri
Sure. We really take, a lot of, pride in opening this new exhibit because it is an exhibit that brings together a lot of, social experiences. This is something that we want people to do together. But it also brings a lot of personal connections. That’s one of the reasons that art therapy felt like such a perfect fit for the exhibit.

00:29:20:18 – 00:29:40:23
Jayatri
Because people can be creative right there in the exhibit. You can play with art, you can draw, you can make music and make those connections, to how that affects your mental health, while also you know, still running through the Giant Heart and playing with, you know, how AI is affecting health. And, you know, it tells a lot of different stories.

00:29:41:01 – 00:30:01:15
Jayatri
So it’s going to be around for a while. This is not just a temporary exhibition. This is one of our core platforms, at the museum moving forward. So we’re just so incredibly honored that we can include, Pepper and Alex’s art in the exhibit, along with, other contributions to really give people that story about art therapy.

00:30:01:17 – 00:30:05:18
Jayatri
And we hope that you’ll come to Philadelphia after November 23rd and come visit.

00:30:05:20 – 00:30:23:11
Dan
Yeah. Let’s get out, get up, get around, get to the Franklin Institute. So that’s what we got to do. So as we go to wrap up, let me just say to all three of you, thank you so very much. For what you do, why you do it and how you do it, and for your leadership and being the force amplifiers and multipliers.

00:30:23:11 – 00:31:05:14
Dan
Thank you. So really appreciate that. This has been Hope Starts With Us, a podcast by the National Alliance on Mental Illness. If you are looking for mental health resources, you are not alone. To connect with the NAMI helpline and to find local resources, visit NAMI.org/help. Text “helpline” to 62640 or dial 800-950-NAMI(6264). Or if you are experiencing an immediate suicide, substance use, or mental health crisis, please call or text 988 to speak with a trained support specialist or visit 988lifeline.org.

00:31:05:16 – 00:31:08:12
Dan
I’m Daniel Gillison. Thanks for listening and be well.

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